JW:
Joseph
Cast your bread upon the water and it shall come back to you a thousand fold. Yeah, but who the hell wants a thousand loaves of soggy bread. - Monster
The New Porphyry
GMark | GMatthew | GLuke | GJohn | |
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Commentary | Sure sounds like fiction. Not impossible, but implausible. 1. Jesus, from the shore, calls to fishermen out in a boat (in the sea). Somehow he can identify them and they can hear him. Shouldn't this be the first miracle. 2. Jesus said to them "follow me" and they immediately follow him. Even Dracula can not hypnotize from that distance. Miracle 2. 3. How did they get to the shore? 4. They left their boat and equipment in the sea. 5. Jesus convinced/hypnotized them by having them hear him (from a distance). Simon's name in Hebrew just happens to mean "hear". 6. Presumably this is the original version of this pericope. The extreme shortcuts then look like style (fiction) rather than summary. | 1. In general GMatthew, as usual, is following GMark pretty, pretty closely for the same story. This suggests that at the time GMark was the only existing authoritative/popular source. 2. Small changes by GMatthew to make it sound more historical/less fictional. Note the tension between using the only related source at the time (not wanting to change because it reduces your credibility) and fitting it to the theology in your time (editing). Small change, walking instead of passing. 3. Simon is "called" Peter as opposed to GMark having Jesus "lay on" "Peter" to Simon. A bigger but necessary edit. 4. Strange/bizarre/macabre not to just give a single name at the introduction of a character. Evidence that Simon was already given the name "Peter" but not earlier in GMatthew but earlier as in GMark. | 1. "a report about him spread through all the surrounding region". This is before Jesus has done anything in GLuke. So the report is based on what he already did in GMark. 2. Now there are at least two Gospels before GLuke. Marcion looks like the earlier version so make that 3 before orthodox GLuke. Now there is less pressure to minimize editing of the original source. And there is the mixing of the GMark source and the Gnostic Marcion original. 2. GLuke now gives Jesus a teaching reputation before he has any disciples. More plausible. 3. "A" spirit says "us" without explanation. Sounds like GLuke has read GMark. 4. "Then the demon, throwing the man down before them, came out of him without doing him any harm". The pull to orthodox editing is creating more contradictions . 5. After sonofmansplaining the demons word of Jesus goes to all the surrounding regions again. The larger the editing of GMark, the larger the contradictions. 6. Now Jesus enters Simon's house without Simon ever having been introduced, except in GMark. 7. Jesus has to continue to preach the Gospel of the Kingdom of God even though he has not yet said what that is. 8. Now Jesus is standing (not passing or walking) by the lake, not sea. 9. The two boats are now at the shore. 10. Jesus has interaction with Simon before he follows him. 11. Now Simon will be a fisher of people, not just men (The author may have been a woman). 12. Now they bring their boats to shore before they follow Jesus. This is significantly more editing than GMatthew and suggests GLuke, especially orthodox GLuke, was after GMatthew. | 1. JtB has been fully converted by orthodox Christianity as not just a named witness to Jesus but a named witness to named witnesses of Jesus. Subsequently, not really any need for orthodox Christianity to have any other Gospels. 2. As always, GJohn looks like a reaction to GMark. Instead of JtB ironically not even recognizing Jesus, "John's" JtB immediately recognizes Jesus. 3. Here the earliest disciples were already disciples of JtB, another reversal of GMark (immediately following). 4. Peter is no longer the first. My guess is this is the original Gnostic GJohn, aliening with Paul. 5. The Greek author knows that "Petros" was never a Greek name but sadly does not know that Cephas was never an Aramaic name (or again the Gnostic original trying to coordinate (so to speak) with Paul). 6. Another full reversal from GMark. They immediately know that Jesus is the Messiah. 7. In between GMark and GJohn Simon moved to Bethsaida. 8. "Jesus the son of Joseph". The author has read GMatthew/GLuke. 9. "“Can anything good come out of Nazareth?” Suggests that in the author's time there was still nothing reMarkable there. 10. "When Jesus saw Nathanael coming toward him, he said of him, “Here is truly an Israelite in whom there is no deceit!" More opposite of GMark. Instead of immediately discrediting disciples GJohn is immediately crediting. 11. Simon does not follow Jesus until Chapter 6. 12. Note that regarding the most important issue that distinguishes the Gospels, named disciples promoting Jesus (which strangely Ehrman has yet to even identify as an issue), the first subsequent Gospel, GMatthew, accomplishes at the very end, while the last Gospel, GJohn, does from the start. Perhaps this is what GMark's Jesus meant when he said "The first shall be last and the last shall be first." |
Joseph
Cast your bread upon the water and it shall come back to you a thousand fold. Yeah, but who the hell wants a thousand loaves of soggy bread. - Monster
The New Porphyry
Statistics: Posted by JoeWallack — Sat Feb 15, 2025 7:02 pm